Electrician Help

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Electrician Help

Postby soyousee » Fri Jan 26, 2007 8:37 pm

Electrician needed, I found a temperature controller very cheap in my farm cat. and want to make sure I wire it right.
The temp probe is on side of unit so it go's inside the freezer
inside there are 4 connections
1 is line
2 is heat
3 is cooling
and 4 is ground
All of my power cards have three wires, Does hot, black, wire from breaker box go to line?
black wire from cooling goes to cooling
black wire from heat goes to heat
All other wires go to ground?
Or all white wires go to ground and all green ground go to case of freezer?
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white is neutral, black hot, green ground

Postby warthog » Tue Jan 30, 2007 6:50 pm

black from the breaker box to hot(edit - sorry typo). black from cooler goes to cooling, black from heater goes to heating. tie the neutrals (white) together with a wire nut or bus bar. all greens go to ground.

make sure controller is rated for the voltage and amperage of the heating and cooling units. use large enough wire for the maximum rated amperage. the freezer should be grounded, tie it together with the other grounds.

many contollers don't switch line voltage, they only send a low voltage signal, and the device then switches its own power based on the control voltage. it dies not sound like this is the case, but it doesn't hurt to double check, and it might hurt alot if you don't.

if you can find wiring diagrams for each component, and post them, or send them to me, i can verify the correct installation.
Last edited by warthog on Wed Feb 14, 2007 11:27 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: white is neutral, black hot, green ground

Postby MondoMage » Mon Feb 12, 2007 10:36 pm

warthog wrote:black from the breaker box to ground. black from cooler goes to cooling, black from heater goes to heating. tie the neutrals (white) together with a wire nut or bus bar. all greens go to ground..


Erm.... black to ground? If wired correctly, black should be a hot wire, which should go to the "line" terminal. Running a hot to the ground could prove mighty interesting :shock:


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The last time I operated on myself, I took out the wrong ...

Postby billvelek » Tue Feb 13, 2007 9:11 am

I learned my lesson the hard way; the last time I operated on myself, I took out the wrong kidney. :lol:

There are a few things in life that I make it a point not to try myself or at least not without seeking absolutely reliable advice, and by reliable, I mean people I know are licensed or certified, or at least check a published book by a reliable source. While it might be interesting to do a little side research into things like medicine and things that affect safety and can bring about a life or death situation -- electrical work being one of them -- there is no way that I would rely on an opinion from an internet forum. There are two many idiots or even folks who might think it is a funny joke to give bad advice. If I didn't hire an electrician, at the very least I would visit the public library or city code office and study ... very carefully ... the established electical codes. That is not meant as commentary on either of the folks who gave advice, although it would appear that at least one of them is wrong; rather, it is just a word of caution.

Cheers.

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Re: The last time I operated on myself, I took out the wrong

Postby soyousee » Tue Feb 13, 2007 9:50 am

billvelek wrote:I learned my lesson the hard way; the last time I operated on myself, I took out the wrong kidney. :lol:

There are a few things in life that I make it a point not to try myself or at least not without seeking absolutely reliable advice, and by reliable, I mean people I know are licensed or certified, or at least check a published book by a reliable source. While it might be interesting to do a little side research into things like medicine and things that affect safety and can bring about a life or death situation -- electrical work being one of them -- there is no way that I would rely on an opinion from an internet forum. There are two many idiots or even folks who might think it is a funny joke to give bad advice. If I didn't hire an electrician, at the very least I would visit the public library or city code office and study ... very carefully ... the established electical codes. That is not meant as commentary on either of the folks who gave advice, although it would appear that at least one of them is wrong; rather, it is just a word of caution.

Cheers.

Bill Velek


Not a problem, I knew it was a brain fart on his part, also before I got my aviation ticket, I was a union electrician, I posted to make sure and refresh my memory, also took electronics, all those colors on a resistor I used to know by heart are just pretty little rings now :? Use it or loose it :cry: On another note the controller had me baffled for a minute or two as the wires from freezer were not color coded. I swapped them a couple of times and discovered the controller had no dead spot. It was supposed to have a 4 deg Differential. Farm supply is sending another. What can I expect for 32.00 :wink: 3b wants 129.00 to do the same thing so I will gladly try another 8)
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Plug and Play

Postby brewmeisterintng » Wed Feb 14, 2007 8:14 am

I bought my temp control unit from Northern Brewers for around 50 bucks. It was a matter of placing the probe and plugging the freezer into it and it into the wall. Set the dial and I was done. Sometimes it is cheaper in the long run to buy one ready to go. :D
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Re: Plug and Play

Postby soyousee » Wed Feb 14, 2007 9:27 am

brewmeisterintng wrote:I bought my temp control unit from Northern Brewers for around 50 bucks. It was a matter of placing the probe and plugging the freezer into it and it into the wall. Set the dial and I was done. Sometimes it is cheaper in the long run to buy one ready to go. :D


Your temp controller only works with cooling OR heat not AND. 3B has the cooling AND heat for 130.00, I have one. This controller works with cooling AND heat for 32.00, I don't mind a little effort with that kind of saving. Stay tuned to this channel for further updates :lol:
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Is the heating element included?

Postby billvelek » Wed Feb 14, 2007 9:42 am

I'm sure a heating element of some sort must be used with those devices, since they are typically used to convert a freezer which has no way of heating itself. Does the one from 3B have the heater included? Does your $32.00 unit have the heater included?

Cheers.

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Re: white is neutral, black hot, green ground

Postby warthog » Wed Feb 14, 2007 12:04 pm

MondoMage wrote:Erm.... black to ground? If wired correctly, black should be a hot wire, which should go to the "line" terminal. Running a hot to the ground could prove mighty interesting :shock:


Derek


actually, it would just blow the breaker (that's what they are for after all).

bill's advice is sound. there are lots of idiots out there, and if soyousee had blindly followed my advice, he would have certainly had a problem.

thanks for checking my work.

i actually do know what i am doing with this sort of thing, i am principal engineer for a company that makes precision environmental chambers, where we routinely control temperature to +/- 0.01 C and have done one that controls to +/- 0.005 C (that's heating and cooling, and they cost a wee bit more than $32)

billvelek wrote:There are two many idiots

i could have sworn there were more than that 8)

again sorry for the typo everyone. i'm glad no one was hurt.
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Re: Is the heating element included?

Postby soyousee » Wed Feb 14, 2007 12:07 pm

billvelek wrote:I'm sure a heating element of some sort must be used with those devices, since they are typically used to convert a freezer which has no way of heating itself. Does the one from 3B have the heater included? Does your $32.00 unit have the heater included?

Cheers.

Bill Velek


Bill these are just controllers, like thermostat on your Air Conditioner. The one he bought for 50.00 controls 1 unit. The 130.00 1 from 3B controlls 2 units. The one from farm supple controls 2 units. Hope this clears things up.
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Re: white is neutral, black hot, green ground

Postby billvelek » Wed Feb 14, 2007 12:13 pm

warthog wrote:
billvelek wrote:There are two many idiots
i could have sworn there were more than that 8)
Heh, heh ... you've got me there; another dumb typo. When I actually proof read my stuff, sometimes I'm amazed at the stupid mistakes I sometimes make, especially with homonyms like there/their, two/too, etc. I guess my fingers are faster than my brain and they try to think for themselves. Anyway, that was a witty comeback; I like it. :D

Cheers.

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Re: Is the heating element included?

Postby billvelek » Wed Feb 14, 2007 12:19 pm

soyousee wrote:Bill these are just controllers, like thermostat on your Air Conditioner. ... snip
So if I now understand correctly, they simple turn current on and off to an outlet?? ... and the double controller would turn one outlet on for the freezer plug when it senses it's too hot, but would turn that one off and turn on the other plug -- which could be used for a light bulb or heating strip -- when it senses that it's too cold??? Sounds like you made a very good deal. When I finally empty my freezer and do a conversion, I won't need to worry about heating it because I'll be keeping it in the house.

Cheers.

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no prob man

Postby warthog » Wed Feb 14, 2007 12:23 pm

thanks bill, :)
i try to proof my posts too. if i'm busy, it doesn't always happen. i completely understand.

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A better Mouse Trap

Postby brewmeisterintng » Wed Feb 14, 2007 7:15 pm

It seems that we homebrewers are always trying to simplify and refine our craft but end up just making it more complicated with new "low cost" gadgits. All in the name of "Better Beer". Sometimes, if not most of the time, simpler is better. Remember folks, it's a hobby and as such you won't get rich brewing your own beer. After all, you are drinking up all the profits.
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Re: A better Mouse Trap

Postby billvelek » Wed Feb 14, 2007 11:19 pm

brewmeisterintng wrote:It seems that we homebrewers are always trying to simplify and refine our craft but end up just making it more complicated with new "low cost" gadgits. All in the name of "Better Beer". Sometimes, if not most of the time, simpler is better. Remember folks, it's a hobby and as such you won't get rich brewing your own beer. After all, you are drinking up all the profits.
I sort of get your point, because I know that some folks make brewing beer harder than it needs to be -- but they may have their reasons that are valid to them even if I can't relate to them personally, so I can't agree with you entirely. There are a lot of homebrewers who are fully content to refine their techniques without bothering with additional equipment. Then there are those who think that more equipment will be the answer to better beer -- and it can be, if used properly at the same time that proper techniques and methods are used. But some people think that spending money on fancy equipment is the only answer -- stainless steel conicals and all of that, but without studying the craft. And many people want that fancy stuff but just can't afford it ... so they try to adapt or improvise with home-gadgits. However, "low-cost" gadgitry is not, in itself, a problem, and being frugal (or cheap) isn't necessarily a problem either.

First, "low cost" gadgits don't necessarily equate with complexity. For example, building a low cost stir-plate from parts that are lying around the house or that can be cheaply acquired doesn't mean that making a starter on that will be any harder or more complex than using a more costly commercial stir plate. But to someone who questions the value of using a stir-plate in the first place, it is understandable that they would see that as a waste. An even better example is comparing a keg conversion to a commercial kettle with a spigot, etc. To someone who doesn't like to build stuff, the time it takes to make a conversion doesn't make sense if you could earn a good wage during that time and spend the extra money on commercial equipment. How about a home-made counterflow chiller compared to a commercial plate-chiller; one is no more 'complex' to use than the other, but someone who doesn't crash-chill their wort might think that both are foolish. The point is that many low-cost gadgits can save homebrewers money and at the same time perform just as well -- or at least acceptably as well -- as higher-cost commercial gear. Some homebrewers also happen to be gadget freaks. Some will build their own maltmill using a lathe, drill press, etc. -- because that's what they like to do. If a homebuilt maltmill functions as well as a commercial mill, then there is no problem.

Second, I don't homebrew to save money, and I find it hard to believe that those of us who devote a LOT of time to our craft are doing it for that reason, either. So the notion that we are drinking up our profits does not apply to most of us.

Now I will admit that much of what I do is probably over-kill, but then again ... this is my hobby, so I don't mind wasting time and money with it. <<Cue to the opening song on Graham Sanders' podcast: "... you're my favorite waste of time".>> 8)

Cheers.

Bill Velek
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