Packaging Tool?

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Packaging Tool?

Postby billvelek » Thu Dec 14, 2006 11:29 am

Not that I'm particularly concerned with this feature, but I did notice that you state on this page -- http://www.beertools.com/html/articles.php?view=242 -- "BTP has a built-in packaging tool which quickly determines how many bottles (or any vessel for that matter) it will take to store your batch", but I can't find that feature anywhere. I know things have been in transition a bit as you have incorporated some recommended changes, fixed bugs, etc. I thought that info might be under the analysis tab where serving size and nutritional info is located. In the blank space beneath "Serving", you might consider placing a field for "Total Servings". A logical alternative would be under "Calculators", where I did not find this feature, either. If it's in there somewhere, you should make it easier to find. Just a thought. I always prep extra bottles and caps, so I don't really care how many it will take to package my batch, but some people might. Just thought I'd drop you a reminder about that. The reason I was reviewing your advertisement in the first place will be discussed in my next post, under a new thread.

Cheers.

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Display

Postby lathe » Thu Dec 14, 2006 11:49 am

Bill,

Please select the display pop up near the beer glass graphic. Packaging is the last item in the list.
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Dohhhhh.

Postby billvelek » Thu Dec 14, 2006 3:45 pm

So sorry. Yes; there it is. :oops: You folks have crammed so much great stuff in this program that it is hard to find everything. Just give me another month or two. :shock:

However, ... (you know me by now) ... I do have a couple of suggestions/requests:

Regarding 'Presets', could you add a 'U.S. Pint' = 16 fluid oz.? It is not listed, and when I created one, it was not added to the 'presets' (apparently we are not supposed to be able to add to or modify 'presets'; if we are, I haven't figured it out yet). While this is not enormously inconvenient, I'd rather not have to define a U.S. Pint repeatedly, for batch after batch (and I DO have over two cases of pint bottles).

Also, if it is possible (for polishing purposes), I'd suggest that the quantity of bottles not initially increment in tenths of a unit. No one bottles part of a bottle, so that just wastes time, and without my eyeglasses on, I could easily mistake .8 units as being 8 bottles. Just more polish here.

Otherwise, this is a GREAT program. Thanks. ... and I'm sorry I'm posting so many questions, but once again, if the User Guide files were fleshed out a bit more ..... Sorry to keep nagging about that; I know ... priorities. Understood.

Cheers.

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Re: Dohhhhh.

Postby slothrob » Thu Dec 14, 2006 4:06 pm

billvelek wrote:Also, if it is possible (for polishing purposes), I'd suggest that the quantity of bottles not initially increment in tenths of a unit. No one bottles part of a bottle, so that just wastes time, and without my eyeglasses on, I could easily mistake .8 units as being 8 bottles.


Good point. This is another reason for fractional numbers to default to "0.8", not ".8". In the lab it's considerred bad practice to leave out the 0 before the decimal for exactly the reason that it's so easy to miss.
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Re: Dohhhhh.

Postby jeff » Thu Dec 14, 2006 4:26 pm

slothrob wrote:Good point. This is another reason for fractional numbers to default to "0.8", not ".8". In the lab it's considerred bad practice to leave out the 0 before the decimal for exactly the reason that it's so easy to miss.


When updating values BTP never omits the 0 in numbers such as 0.8. However, the user can enter .8 if they prefer.
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One more concern ...

Postby billvelek » Thu Dec 14, 2006 4:26 pm

Obviously, there is no way for BTP to be able to accurately predict the volume to be bottled. The recipe contains the final volume, assuming that the boil-off is accurate, but then there are additional factors such as whether a user skims during the boil and/or how much trub is in the fermenter, and even whether a user went to a secondary or not (I have losses in each). And then there is the variable volume of the primer; how much water is used to dissolve the primer?

If I'm not mistaken (and I know I've been missing a lot), the only way for me to adjust the volume for packaging is to change the "Final Volume", which seems to me to be altering the results of the recipe, and then if I should hit 'save' again, that would seem to look odd the next time I open that recipe.

It just seems to me that there ought to be a way to enter the 'Volume Drawn from Fermenter' plus the 'Primer Volume' to get the 'Total Volume for Packaging' ... and then the program would make all determinations of number of bottles, etc., based on that last figure.

Also, when your 'Packaging" screen displays, on the bottom left we have "Quantity" and opposite that on the bottom right we have "Units", but they have no relationship, so it is somewhat counter-intuitive, in my opinion. You have an enormous amount of space on that tab, so I think there are any number of ways to clarify that ... for polish ... such as changing the label to say: "Units of Measure for Total/Remaining Volume".

Just a few thoughts.

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Re: One more concern ...

Postby jeff » Thu Dec 14, 2006 4:32 pm

billvelek wrote:If I'm not mistaken (and I know I've been missing a lot), the only way for me to adjust the volume for packaging is to change the "Final Volume", which seems to me to be altering the results of the recipe, and then if I should hit 'save' again, that would seem to look odd the next time I open that recipe.

It just seems to me that there ought to be a way to enter the 'Volume Drawn from Fermenter' plus the 'Primer Volume' to get the 'Total Volume for Packaging' ... and then the program would make all determinations of number of bottles, etc., based on that last figure.


Display Popup Menu->Volume Adjustments
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But ...

Postby billvelek » Thu Dec 14, 2006 5:14 pm

Thanks, Jeff. That is a lot clearer now. But since I don't differentiate between trub loss and rack loss -- and just consider what I siphon from my fermenter -- I would recommend that you might also allow a user to just directly enter the volume drawn from the fermenter -- and then that amount would be used to determine the amount/volume of primer -- and then that total amount could be used for 'packaging'. Unless there is some other purpose/function, I don't think people want to get hung-up on what percentage was trub and what percentage was racking loss.

I know that I've been a pain in the !@# with all my questions and comments, but I hope to make it up to you with a glowing recommendation in BrewingEquipment at YahooGroups where I am the owner/moderator -- now with 472 members and growing ... :D ... and maybe that will net some sales for you. For anyone interested, the URL is: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/BrewingEquipment ... and I'm not trying to tempt folks away from this site. There is plenty of useful discussion on both.

I am extremely satisified with your progam -- despite my occasional remarks -- and I just want to get a few batches under my belt with this before I publish a report to my group.

Thanks again for your patience, prompt replies, and very helpful attitude.

Cheers.

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add half liter bottles as Preset?

Postby bzwrxbz » Thu Dec 14, 2006 6:35 pm

Could you guys add half liter (500mL) bottle as a Preset package? They are super common here in Deutschland. :wink:
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Packaging Bug?

Postby djavet » Sun Jan 07, 2007 7:24 am

Hello

If I select the packaging display and add my bottle, the quantity and size are in liter, but the total are displaying in gallon...
Is that a bug?
I select everywhere liter as per default.

Regards, Dom
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Postby slothrob » Sun Jan 07, 2007 9:02 am

Double click on the bottle description in the Packaging window, a window will appear. Choose Liters for the volume.

Also, be sure to choose Liters in the Packaging window itself (lower right corner).

Also, Liters on Preferences window.

But I think the first was what you were looking for.
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Postby djavet » Mon Jan 08, 2007 5:44 am

Yes, I've checked and over checked. Here's my screen:
Image

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That's really weird, Dom

Postby billvelek » Mon Jan 08, 2007 9:56 am

I notice the date on your recipe is from 2005; did you load that from favorites on BeerTools.com or import the file from ProMash or anything like that? Also, what operating system are you using, etc.? ... because I'm not duplicating that; all I do is just change the 'Units' of measure setting at the lower right corner of the 'Packaging' display, and it expresses all volumes accordingly. I thought maybe it was perhaps because the figure comes from the 'volume adjustment' screen, but I tried that and still can't get it to display like yours.

Cheers.

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Postby djavet » Mon Jan 08, 2007 10:35 am

This one are from the online DB adapt into liters.
But I've the same with my own custom recipe start frmo zero in liters. Same bug.

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Postby slothrob » Mon Jan 08, 2007 10:37 am

Yeah, I couldn't duplicate this either.
When I change the "Unit" field, the units change from Gallons to Liters.
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